OMAC Propaganda? (split from New Track Layout Diagram)

[straightliner]

Are we going too get real info about a track here? Hopefully this site leads too something and doesn't end up like the other sites (PC, FH, HT). These others are a waste of time now. They look like OMAC propaganda bull.:mad:

[dirt racer]

Are we going too get real info about a track here? Hopefully this site leads too something and doesn't end up like the other sites (PC, FH, HT). These others are a waste of time now. They look like OMAC propaganda bull.:mad:

Yep, you noticed that too. No bull here, just the straight scoops. The good, the bad, and the ugly. :eek:

Building a racing facility from scratch will require volunteer help from the entire racing community. This site was setup to help get the word out to everyone that wants to help. :D

[dirt racer]

Which 1/8 mile is this?:confused: Not the one I hear about PG talking about after too many beers I hope.:rolleyes:

All talk and no walk

No, not that one. I have no idea what PG was talking about. (neither does he) ;)

[Chad89GT]

Are we going too get real info about a track here? Hopefully this site leads too something and doesn't end up like the other sites (PC, FH, HT). These others are a waste of time now. They look like OMAC propaganda bull.:mad:

If you want the "real info" you best start listening to that "OMAC bull" as you so elequently put it. If SORT can make a temp track happen on a 30-day revokeable lease then more power to them... but please don't knock the hard work people have put into P9 as a permanent facility. They're doing it so people like YOU can race at a safe, mondern facility... and you thank them by saying they're full of bull. :(

It's funny how everyone thinks Paul is going to build an 1/8 mile track... everyone except Paul that is! Everyone heard it from a guy who heard it from a guy Paul called to tell them to get ready... yet no one has heard it directly from Paul. I see Paul all the time (my shop is next to his) and we laugh and joke about that rumor.

[punishum]

I have waited for a forum like this. SORT's site was the answer but as always the "Internet Thugs" H-I-D-E behind their computers and can't say things to your face.

P9 has been a sore contention for a long time. Pasha presently occupies the lot. Now Pasha officials said they "CAN NOT" have any lights after dark. How much light do you think a track emmits?

And Oh, be watching the June episode of PunishUM on K-5 as we will have the official announcment from Pasha getting an extended, multi-year lease on, You guessed it . . . P9. How do I know this? Pasha is one of our many committed sponsors. That's how. :p :p :p :p :p Now put that into your pipe and "Smok UM ! !"

[Chad89GT]

Enjoy your new forum. Aloha.

[dirt racer]

Everyone heard it from a guy who heard it from a guy Paul called to tell them to get ready... yet no one has heard it directly from Paul. I see Paul all the time (my shop is next to his) and we laugh and joke about that rumor.

Perhaps Paul should log on to one of the sites and set the record straight then. Unless of course, he is the one that's starting the rumors. :rolleyes:

[Mud Packer]

Enjoy your new forum. Aloha.
Dont let the door hitcha !

[straightliner]

Your orders up! Another hot fresh bowl of bull!


Look Chump89GT you don't speak for me. You and or friend (Arch-Idiot) need to step back and look at just how far OMAC has gotten us. LOOK AT YOUR TIMELINE!!! JUST HOW FAR DID IT GET US IN 20 YEARS?? I TALKED TO THESE FOLKS AT THE CAR SHOW THIS PAST SUNDAY. I'VE SEEN THEM ON CHANNEL 54 WORKING ON TRYING TO GET US A TRACK. I CAN TELL THEY BEEN WORKING ON THIS A HELL OF ALOT HARDER THAN OMAC HAS.

IF YOU GUYS HAD ANY BRAINS YOU WOULD SEE THAT!! :mad:

SEE NOW YOU'VE PISSED ME OFF AGAIN IT IS NOT EVEN NOON YET :mad:

WHY DON'T YOU GO BACK TO CHUCKIE CHEESE FOR MORE OF YOUR MEETING ON WANT YOU ARE DOING TO "BUILD THE TRACK".




I'LL BE BAN FROM HERE TOO??

[Admin]

I'LL BE BAN FROM HERE TOO??

Not likely. The forum owner is a strong proponent of free speech. (one of the things that makes this country so great!) I will probably split this thread into another topic though. (when I figure out how to do it :confused: )

[Chad89GT]

Your orders up! Another hot fresh bowl of bull!


Look Chump89GT you don't speak for me. You and or friend (Arch-Idiot) need to step back and look at just how far OMAC has gotten us. LOOK AT YOUR TIMELINE!!! JUST HOW FAR DID IT GET US IN 20 YEARS?? I TALKED TO THESE FOLKS AT THE CAR SHOW THIS PAST SUNDAY. I'VE SEEN THEM ON CHANNEL 54 WORKING ON TRYING TO GET US A TRACK. I CAN TELL THEY BEEN WORKING ON THIS A HELL OF ALOT HARDER THAN OMAC HAS.

IF YOU GUYS HAD ANY BRAINS YOU WOULD SEE THAT!! :mad:

SEE NOW YOU'VE PISSED ME OFF AGAIN IT IS NOT EVEN NOON YET :mad:

WHY DON'T YOU GO BACK TO CHUCKIE CHEESE FOR MORE OF YOUR MEETING ON WANT YOU ARE DOING TO "BUILD THE TRACK".




I'LL BE BAN FROM HERE TOO??

Anyone working for a place to race deserves your respect, whether you agree with how they're going about it or not. You don't see OMAC belittling SORT's efforts and calling them names... why all the hostility? Do you honestly believe there is an OMAC conspriracy to lie to everyone and swindle the Oahu racing community out of a track forever? Seriously, think about that and how rediculous it sounds. OMAC is made up or racers and promoters.... racing is our passion and we're trying to get back "on track". What could we possibly gain that could replace that? I can tell you I haven't made a dime off my efforts with OMAC... just the opposite... we all contribute out of our own pockets. We just want to race again.

You want to talk about timelines and how long things take. This is Hawaii... everything takes a long time. SORT is just now finding out how long these things take. I congratulate them for working hard on the NHB level (which was done in the 90s for P9 as well)... but there's a long road ahead. It's good to have enthusiam, but don't be blinded to the process. If SORT can make headway then more power to them, but no need to get nuts at each other.

We're all working for the same thing here. Negativity is what keeps this community divided. You seem to know who I am, maybe next time we're at an event you can introduce yourself and we'll have a conversation about it.

[punishum]

Anyone working for a place to race deserves your respect, whether you agree with how they're going about it or not. You don't see OMAC belittling SORT's efforts and calling them names... why all the hostility?

REALLY ! ! A whole bunch of you OMAC people tried to sabotage my drifting at the stadium. Sending letters to politicians like Councilman Cachola and Senator Sakamoto. Who by the way are supporters of YOU KNOW WHO ! ! BUT, Les and I still won despite the GAMES ! !

The only one from OMAC that came out to support us and told me Good Luck, was Chris Messer. I have respect from him and only him.

So Don't say anyone who works to get a place to race deserves respect. Apparently not from any of you guys. And oh, by the way, Our drifting at the stadium is the "ONLY" legal racing going on on Oahu, Period ! ! :p :p :p

All the guys on FH have been slamming what we have done. NO respect. Of all the thousands of hours spent and I made absolutely NO money and still all the Shit talking.

So don't give me any of that R-E-S-P-E-C-T mallarchy. That is Frigen BULL S*** ! ! Especially coming from you guys. Damn Cock Blockers.

[Chad89GT]

Huh? Who from OMAC tried to sabotage XD-1? I certainly didn't. Chris volunteered to represent OMAC at the meeitngs... he was there to rep us all because many of us coudln't get off work. Not really a problem for me anymore! :p


Is SCCA Solo not considered leagal racing? My understanding is they have dates throughout the year. :confused:


As for FH, lots of those people are young kids that don't respect much at all. Not sure how that translates to OMAC.

[punishum]

Chris came out from what he said at the luncheon was that he had the time and I don't recall him saying he was coming out as a rep for OMAC.

As for the SCCA, they do a great job but they are a timed event NOT a head to head competition; a race. Which is what we had.
Like running singles on a drag strip or only qualifying at Indy.

And unfortunately for the other site being zapped, all the evidence erased, your chairman Mr. Kitchens and other members all bashed our efforts at the stadium and posted a lot of negative things to discourage others from attending. AS well as sending faxes to the Gov's office, other politicians and the Aiea NHB during the initial proceedings. Which they never did their homework to find out I was an elected official on that board. And my fellow members voted unanimously not to take any action in regards to that silly fax. The fax basically was not to support them because they is a Kaka, Shi Shi, Pooh Pooh head. Very professional.
Sun Tzu, " Know thy enemy and know thyself . . "

This is like a merry-go-round, going no where. Like talking to a brick wall.

OMAC has their agenda and so does SORT. And the best one will win. Just like a race, there will only be one winner. And it will suck to be the loser. :D Because there will be a loser very shortly. And they all lived happily ever after. Hallelujah, Sayonara, Adios, Buon Giorno,
A Hui Hou, The End, Amen. Ladies and Gentlemen, Start your engines.

[Chad89GT]

Hmmm, I vaugely remember them sending in a letter, but honestly I don't remember the content. We've all done things to hurt each other's efforts in the past, and that is unfortunate. Adversarial attitudes will not help this community reach it's goal. If a track opens there are no "losers" as we'll all be back to racing again... which is what this is all about, right?

A friendly rivalry between SORT and OMAC is to be expected... but the past conduct between the 2 sets a bad example of sportsmanship for our community. I think it's time to put the name calling, sabotaging, back stabbing and all that other bullshit aside and let each group do their own work. If it happens that we cross paths during our efforts, then we act professionally and rationally towards each other... like the adults we are who enjoy a passion for the same sport.

[straightliner]

Looks like Chump89GT stepped on his dick again :cool:

Lets not forget the letters against condemnation of HRP (Why totally burn the only track before another is built?) How about the letters against Evelyn's appiontment.

Looks like you guys (OMAC) have been working against was these folks have been for.

You can't show any progress in what you done to help get a track built here on Oahu. Your wasting everyones time. GET THE *UCK OUT OF THE WAY ALREADY!! :mad: :mad: :mad:

[straightliner]

Thanks punishum for posting about their BS they been trying. :D

[punishum]

Thanks Straghtliner.

No one knows more about this game and the "Smoke & Mirrors" than MO and I. Ask MO, he knows. I was there from the BRAC days. 1993 brah. From Kali Watson to Cayetano. I know the names and where the bodies are buried.

Now I heard the 1/8 mile rumor from several people. The start up date varies from June of this year to December just in time for South Pac. But the purp of the rumor is still the same. Everyone says they heard it was from Paul G. I am NOT starting this rumor. Saying just what I was told. See, being the states only all Hawaii motorsports TV Show everyone talks to me. Same thing like all the rumors last year that HRP was going to reopen about a dozen times. Then they blame me for starting that rumor. All this shibai to keep everyone from helping SORT. TO keep them in line that the Ole Regime is still in charge. Like the attorneys from Campbell said time and time again, I have it on tape from a Conf Comm too, " We did NOT ask the lessee to leave." I even have one of the politicians from the state side who was a supporter of the defunct tax credit say that the Council Committe Chair was not going to hear the matter of condemnation on camera, he said that to me. That's colusion Brah. ILLEGAL ! ! Stoooopid ! !

NOW from What I understand is Mr. Kitchens also tried to get SORT banned from having a booth at the NEX car show this past weekend.
Is that a freindly rivalry? The shit that OMAC has been doing is vicious and malicious. Bordering on defamation.

Now I got a call from a person from OMAC asking me to help with Drift RCs etc. I did. I gave him names and shops to call. Thus OMAC getting that for your rally on June 3rd. No biggie.

But you guys have gone out of your way from OMAC to cock block. And don't you guys ever learn? You got no "JUICE" brah.

The Ole Regime had over 20 years to do the right thing. My group in the last few months did more community things with the drifting than all the promoters have NEVER done since DAY 1. All of them. I did Shriners Hospital and MADD and that was just the start. All without fanfare because it is the RIGHT Thing to DO ! !

Bible says," Much is given, much is expected." All the leadership / managers as MO would call them ( Because the former lease with Campbell forbade Sub-Letting the parcel. ) has ever done is line their pockets at the expense of the racer (s) and have NEVER fixed or maintained the facility.

It is time for change, a civil unrest is happening because the Ole Guard " Never Lead, Never followed and
Won't get the hell out of Da Way ! !"

Politicains better wake up because the racing community has more numbers than any union.

"Viva Le Revulcione ! !"

[Chad89GT]

I can see the hate and misinformation is too think in here to have a civil conversation. The hypocrisy is too much to take as well... like you're all innocent victims of the evil OMAC conspiracy. As if you never did anything to block progress at P9. Get a grip!

Enjoy your little forum of 4 or 5 people.

[punishum]

You are getting a few shots in, I fire back, you fire back. You guys kept slamming Les on FH, and ganged up on him. he stood up to the bullying over there and you get some return fire and now you gonna leave?

I'm going home, ouch, my pussy hurts. :eek: :eek:

Sorry to see you go. You are what makes this interesting. Instead of talking about titties and weed.

You seem like an intelligent guy and are entitled to your own opinions. But I don't agree with your conclusions and you need to take them blinders off man.

The light is shedding a lot of truths and you guys keep sticking your head in the sand. Gonna be a sad day when you realize that the Emperor had no clothes.

[straightliner]

Like Mud said "Don't let the door hit cha' in the ass" :D

[prk247]

Sorry to see you go. You are what makes this interesting. Instead of talking about titties and weed.

got something against titties? :confused: :eek:

[Mud Packer]

I can see the hate and misinformation is too think in here to have a civil conversation. The hypocrisy is too much to take as well... like you're all innocent victims of the evil OMAC conspiracy. As if you never did anything to block progress at P9. Get a grip!

Enjoy your little forum of 4 or 5 people.
How are you going to have progress at P9 if somebody occupies the area and has a contract to stay there a few more years? And by the way, these 4 or 5 people on this little forum are getting us a place to play! SORT rocks, you guys suck! p.s. have you went to FH lately? They really suck.

[punishum]

I have nothing against titties. I love them. Big, small etc. :D Only when a thread that was listed as a racetrack forum turns into a silly topic about the mammary gland. :rolleyes:

Dialogue between opposing parties is what peaks interest. If it were sterile then we would not have as many eyes peering in on RIH in just its first week. FH wanted to be sterile. Les chose not to be. And a moderator that will kick someone off because of their views is not what Dirt will do.

Now Chad brings up viewpoints he and OMAC believe in and us SORT supporters see it 180 degrees different.

I respect Chad's more toned down rhetoric on RIH then how he was on FH.

If you go Chad, you'd be sad because boring is not what you wanted. That is why you venured to RIH in the first place. :D

Also the www.punishum.com site will be up before next weeks K-5 airing and RIH will be the official forum of PU. So if you click onto the PU forum page you will be directed right here to RIH. :D

[MOD50]

World Of Outlaws Back On T.V on the speed channel this sunday may 13 @8:00am. (Yes Its On Mothers Day) So record it if you can. ENJOY FOLKS!http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h210/skmj/movingthem51.gif

[straightliner]

Well I see the Propaganda Minister is back :mad: :mad:

Some "donkey" emailed me looking for help with their car show and I see they are also asking for donations to help put it on. What a joke.

If they need to raise funds to pay for their show, How 'bout setting up a dunking booth. I bet they could make a ton of money by putting Chump89GT in it. And even more with Arch-Idiot in it.

Oh hell who needs a dunking tank when the harbor is right there. :rolleyes:

:D :D :D :D

[straightliner]

The thought brings a smile to my face :D :D :D :D

One splash Two splash

Maybe it could be a b-o-u-n-t-y instead? I know of a bunch of guys who would be game for that. :D :D :D :D

[dirt racer]

"I see they are also asking for donations to help put it on."

"If they need to raise funds to pay for their show, How 'bout setting up a dunking booth."

Perhaps a more serious question is "if they need to collect donations to pay for a car show, how in the world do they expect to acquire a $48 million dollar property and build a racetrack on it?"

The assessed value of Parcel 9 is a matter of public record:

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g14/dirt_racer/parcel9value2-1.jpg




It's also strange that they would have a commercial auto dealer putting on a display for sales purposes, yet the OMAC club members and organizers are expected to pay for the show through donations. :confused:

And extremely odd that they would be asking for donations to pay for the OMAC forums. We use the same software and web server, and I can tell you the cost of the software was $85, and only $14.95/month for the web hosting. Hardly something we need donations for. :eek:

[Chad89GT]

Perhaps a more serious question is "if they need to collect donations to pay for a car show, how in the world do they expect to acquire a $48 million dollar property and build a racetrack on it?"

The assessed value of Parcel 9 is a matter of public record:

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g14/dirt_racer/parcel9value2-1.jpg




It's also strange that they would have a commercial auto dealer putting on a display for sales purposes, yet the OMAC club members and organizers are expected to pay for the show through donations. :confused:

And extremely odd that they would be asking for donations to pay for the OMAC forums. We use the same software and web server, and I can tell you the cost of the software was $85, and only $14.95/month for the web hosting. Hardly something we need donations for. :eek:
Again you're talking about things you don't understand. You've had a forum for what? A week? Now you're an expert? I think not. Go out and price a dedicated server from a reputable provider and see what you come back with.

BTW, you're getting robbed on the price of your software and provider plan for a site this small. I pay less a month for 8 domains (including PC.com) and the forum software was free.

While you're posting internet links, go find the one where the Govenor tells the Feds that land at Kalaeloa is worthless due to poor infastructure. We've had this conversation before and used real-world examples to determine a realistic value of the land. It was substatially less, but that all got washed away when FH took a shit.

Also, OMAC is not building the track. We're working with the developer who has built many multi-million dollar projects in the past. I think he's OK for money, but your concerns are appreciated.

[straightliner]

So OMAC is doing the leg work for some big developer. :rolleyes:

Just what guarantee do you think that you have that your developer won't stab you in the back after he get the land that you worked to get for him? :rolleyes:

I like your "I think he's OK for money" statement. Sure thing. OK. Way to go.:rolleyes:

[all4dirt]

The big developer has plans to buy P9 and then sell it. He wants the valuable real-estate around P9 so they can do like they do in Florida. Have these millionaires buy expensive condos with their own landing strip for their private planes.

The purchase of P9 is not done because he cares about the racers or whether we have a track or not. It's because he has developers insight and can see the potential money this place can make for him.:( :( :(

[Chad89GT]

So OMAC is doing the leg work for some big developer. :rolleyes:

Just what guarantee do you think that you have that your developer won't stab you in the back after he get the land that you worked to get for him? :rolleyes:

I like your "I think he's OK for money" statement. Sure thing. OK. Way to go.:rolleyes:

OMAC is helping a LOCAL developer promote this project because we believe it is the best long-term solution. If you disagree, that's cool too. Can't please everyone.

We've all seen how much work has gone into P9 thus far. Years of red tape, base closure process, neighborhood board presentations, EISs, scaled blue prints, detailed business plan (buggah is over 1" thick!) etc etc. Tracy has been at every meeting MO presented at. He can tell you how much time and effort has gone into this. That tells me they're dedicated to making it happen. And even though MO is no longer involved, the developer himself is a race fan so that helps a little too. But you are right, there is no "guarantee". I don't think any project like this can be guaranteed... you just have to look at the situation and make a judgement call.

[dirt racer]

... you just have to look at the situation and make a judgement call.

Yeah well, when the developer is holding all these "high level" meetings and telling everyone that he plans on selling the property once he gets it, it's not too hard for some of us to figure out where he's coming from. Especially when his partner (for the past 20 years) has been getting drunk and bragging about how much money he was going to make after he sold the DHHL property.

Yeah sure, it's OK because MO's not involved anymore ;) ;)

We believe everything you tell us Chad! :confused: :D

[dirt racer]

OMAC is helping a LOCAL developer promote this project because we believe it is the best long-term solution.

Then why not get this multi-million dollar developer to pay for the show so you don't have to collect donations? You guys are too much! :eek:

[dirt racer]

So OMAC is doing the leg work for some big developer. :rolleyes:

Just what guarantee do you think that you have that your developer won't stab you in the back after he get the land that you worked to get for him? :rolleyes:

I like your "I think he's OK for money" statement. Sure thing. OK. Way to go.:rolleyes:


It'll be --- "so long suckers!" :rolleyes:

[Need4Speed]

Why did Hanabusa support the KoOlina - Stone tax and not the Kalaeloa - Oakland tax? Did the race track developer offer her a condo or a race car? My guess is she could use the condo, not the race car :(

[lois]

Why did Hanabusa support the KoOlina - Stone tax and not the Kalaeloa - Oakland tax? Did the race track developer offer her a condo or a race car? My guess is she could use the condo, not the race car :(

*n00b alert here--no insults necesssary*

just asking--has Hanabusa helped or hurt the race community?


from what i have read (which is quite limited but i AM interested now)

it seems she was against a race track.

[Need4Speed]

That was not meant as an insult. It was more of a suggestion.

[dirt racer]

*n00b alert here--no insults necesssary*

just asking--has Hanabusa helped or hurt the race community?


from what i have read (which is quite limited but i AM interested now)

it seems she was against a race track.

Colleen supports her constituents which are primarily dirt track racers that were left out of the P9 "get rich quick" scheme. I suppose it's kinda hard to support someone that goes before these committees and tells them he had no hand in the sale of the HRP, when THE LEGISLATORS KNEW FULL WELL THAT WAS NOT THE CASE! Besides, all she would have to do is talk to her counterpart in the House that has known about the DHHL "get rich quick" scheme for years and always shot it down. It probably didn't help to have the rep that introduced the bill set to make 9 million dollars on the deal for himself. Kinda looks bad. :(

These clowns are sure fun to watch though! :D

[lois]

That was not meant as an insult. It was more of a suggestion.



oh i apologize...i CERTAINLY did not mean you.

just the other person here who thinks drumming up support means insulting new people digging for information.

[lois]

Colleen supports her constituents which are primarily dirt track racers that were left out of the P9 "get rich quick" scheme. I suppose it's kinda hard to support someone that goes before these committees and tells them he had no hand in the sale of the HRP, when THE LEGISLATORS KNEW FULL WELL THAT WAS NOT THE CASE! Besides, all she would have to do is talk to her counterpart in the House that has known about the DHHL "get rich quick" scheme for years and always shot it down. It probably didn't help to have the rep that introduced the bill set to make 9 million dollars on the deal for himself. Kinda looks bad. :(

These clowns are sure fun to watch though! :D



who is "he"?

i think some of us...even us n00bs

know most of the players

perhaps making a...so to speak..."mission statement" would be nice

i have to apologize. i haven't kept up with the "who's who" in racing since i've left that community so maybe a start from scratch would behoove you guys. other than that a site like this only becomes a "bitch about your opposition" club. LOLORZ i've seen it before.


i really did just come to learn. you can thank your Pit Bull for my more than intended posts.

[dirt racer]

who is "he"?


He is MO! The former lease/buy option holder who sold the interest to commercial developer Irongate, and left all the racers out on the street (literally). :(

The one OMAC was formed (by him) to support him and his silent partner Mr. E.

P.S. Dont' tell anyone though because it's supposed to be a secret...:cool:

[Need4Speed]

I'm still not clear on why Colleen Hanabusa supported Stone on his get rich quick scheme and not Oakland. Just because the dirt racers were left out she doesn't support the other racing types? I don't understand where the loyalty is. In the people or in her friends?

[dirt racer]

i really did just come to learn.


Pssssssst lois. Check out page 3 of the Irongate Deed. Look at the warranties clause to see who the 'predecessor-in-interest' was. Just dont' tell anyone THAT IT WAS HAWAII MOTORSPORT CENTER!. There's supposed to be some kind of "confidentiality agreement". :cool:

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g14/dirt_racer/DEED3.jpg

[dirt racer]

Psssst lois. Check this out. Sounds like someone was telling the whole world that the lease expired and couldn't be renewed.

http://kapio.kcc.hawaii.edu/upload/fullnews.php?id=222







Funny how that's not what the landowner said. :confused: :confused: :confused:

"This is a decision made by Hawai'i Raceway Park and was not caused by Campbell Estate," estate spokeswoman Theresia McMurdo said. "We have not asked Hawai'i Raceway Park to leave and in fact we have been extending the lease."

http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/2006/Jan/27/ln/FP601270359.html

[punishum]

Pit Bull @ the front door. I guess it all depends on the messenger huh.

You all have no idea how much work it takes to lobby and to get the word out. As Dirt can attest too it is almost a full time job with no pay or benefits.

Dirt and I went tonight to a board presentation in regards to our drifting @ the stadium. You ought to try and appraoch a hostile crowd to defend the sport and why we are @ the stadium and have all the drifters who are benefitting by doing nothing keep bashing you too. AS the saying goes those who can't teach and those who can do. I guess the racers like the view from the fence the best. And don't say OH, well you guys are making money. Because I have not made a single penny from all of this hard work and as a matter of fact it costs me money to keep this fight going.

SORT and a few of us who went to the legislature everytime and there were 6 or 7 people. Where are the rest of all you supposed concerned racers and supporters?

Instead of attacking others on the forums with your keyboards and mouse, you should be more constructive like sending emails to the politicians and decision makers. Because the politicians don't look @ this forum and they'd rather be golfing then hear racers complain because everyone is sitting on their collective asses instead of complaining to the decision makers. Wake up People ! !

[dirt racer]

I'm still not clear on why Colleen Hanabusa supported Stone on his get rich quick scheme and not Oakland. Just because the dirt racers were left out she doesn't support the other racing types? I don't understand where the loyalty is. In the people or in her friends?

There never was going to be a racetrack at P9. The plan is to acquire the land and sell it. The Leg found out about the scheme. They are smarter than OMAC supporters. :D

If MO was so for all the other racers, why not just lease the property like SORT is doing? Because he couldn't turn around and sell it that's why. It was never about building a track, it was about buying land and selling it - just like what happened to HRP.

[Need4Speed]

The Legislature knows about schemes all too well. For some reason they don't support this particular get rich quick scheme at Kalaeloa. Mike Oakland had a lease, a variance and no sewers before the land sold. HRP was also there for 42 years and operating as a racing facility until it closed. I really don't see where it was just about buying and selling land.

[lois]

Where are the rest of all you supposed concerned racers and supporters?

i guess you like to just attack, attack, attack, eh? we're trickling in. instead of being so "Mr. Self-Important I Do Everything" to us Johnny Come Latelys, why don't you inform us like dirt racer instead of blindly lashing out?


Instead of attacking others on the forums with your keyboards and mouse,


EXCUSE ME? BWAHAHAHAHA! OMGWTFBBQ action. who attacked who first? why don't you re-read your asshole comments towards Da Surfa, who came in support of ALL racers, which then made me post?


you should be more constructive like sending emails to the politicians and decision makers.

like i told dirt racer above, i AM planning on helping, i have so much down time at work i am beside myself on what to do besides playing Mahjongg on the 'puter. i decided to read up on stuff and i am in the process of gathering info. so i come here and instead of getting GOOD INFO like dirt is finally posting, me and Da Surfa get served a plate of offensive bullshit.

since dirt is finally here and posting up relevant info and not antagonistic bullshit like you did, i'll try to simply disregard anything you have to say from here and just tell myself you're simply another one of those idiotic kids that post up at FH since that is, apparently, how you like to present yourself to people joining here.

if you are the Tracy that i once knew...hoo boy, *shame*

[lois]

http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/2006/Jan/27/ln/FP601270359.html

And in January 2005, Oakland's zoning variance expired.

"We have an expired variance, we have cesspools closing under federal mandate and we have a lease that's expiring," Oakland said


sorry for my ignorance about zoning laws but what is a "zoning variance" and what are the ramifications of it "expiring"? is that like the place got re-zoned under a different classification?

[zerozero]

lois - if you want some straight answers you know where to find me.

The slant on everything here is horrible.

I prefer not to participate in this bullshit as it's not productive.

#00

[lois]

thanks, you can PM me. elsewhere...i am truly curious to see BOTH sides and am at a loss as to the extreme animosity displayed by certain members towards potential supporters...utterly amazing.

like i've said elsewhere i just want to see both sides, and weigh it on my own

however--i don't need an asshat e-thugging me on my fact-finding (or whatever anyone chooses to call it) mission.

you want to continue e-thugging me, Tracy, come down to my workplace and say it to my face. i have no problems calling people what i think of them straight to their faces.

[punishum]

Come to your work place and waste my time? You aren't getting it anyway and if you want to take it personally? You may be new to RIH but you have been to the other sites and posted. So don't act all so innocent and that all of this is brand spanking new news to you in regard to what is happening.

Because if you knew me from before like the drag strip, and hung out with Walt and all of us after the races then you would know I was preaching about rallying the racers and support a change in the managment @ HRP from years ago while the track was still open. So don't blame me for all this problems and mr. important crap.

In my experience with all the racers and they all said this to my face when I was trying to institute change was " I no care. AS long as I have a place to race." And now, there is no place to race and ONLY a handful of people are doing the leg work and everyone else is STILL sitting on the fence.

Wether you are a OMAC or SORT supporter. OMAC is trying to rally the troops to support them and as even they can attest to it, it is like pulling teeth to get these "Concerned Racers" to volunteer to help their or any cause that will in the end help out all racers.

Get in the fight wether you support either side but do something to help. UNreal ! ! I am trying to light a fire under everyone and all I hear is whining.

[dirt racer]

sorry for my ignorance about zoning laws but what is a "zoning variance" and what are the ramifications of it "expiring"? is that like the place got re-zoned under a different classification?

The way I understand the history of the place is that it was originally built on AG land which was not a problem in 1964. The LUO "Land Use Ordinance" was subsequently changed to require motorsports facilities on Oahu to have industrial zoning. (This is not a problem for HRP given the geographic location.) Rather than having the property rezoned, the leaseholders opted to obtain a "variance" which allowed them to operate the track on AG land without a zoning change - saving a considerable amount of money on property tax. It is interesting that the track operated without the variance for over a year without being fined for it. The leaseholders could have also applied for another variance. So the expired variance was yet another bullshit reason to close the track IMO.

The EPA mandate concerning cesspools is something many individual homeowners have had to deal with and it doesn't cost $2 million dollars to connect to the sewer line which is what the leaseholders were telling everyone. Another bullshit reason to close the track. At any rate, Pardise Lua offered and provided free portable toilets so the racers could continue racing, until the track was finally closed last April.

With regards to animosity...The buy option at 13 million for a 67 acre park with a racetrack on it was not a bad deal. I personally know some racers that could have joined a hui and purchased the track to keep it running. We were never given that opportunity. We were all being told that the "lease had expired and could not be renewed". And then that Campbell had sold the property to the developer without MO's involvement. We know now that those statements were not true.

As Mud and the others continually point out - we were screwed out of a track. Now the OMAC members think we are going to support the "developers" that screwed us. So they can acquire 139 acres of DHHL property for 10 cents on the dollar. Then resell it for their own personal profit? No thanks. :mad:

[lois]

Come to your work place and waste my time? You aren't getting it anyway and if you want to take it personally? You may be new to RIH but you have been to the other sites and posted. So don't act all so innocent and that all of this is brand spanking new news to you in regard to what is happening.

Because if you knew me from before like the drag strip, and hung out with Walt and all of us after the races then you would know I was preaching about rallying the racers and support a change in the managment @ HRP from years ago while the track was still open. So don't blame me for all this problems and mr. important crap.

In my experience with all the racers and they all said this to my face when I was trying to institute change was " I no care. AS long as I have a place to race." And now, there is no place to race and ONLY a handful of people are doing the leg work and everyone else is STILL sitting on the fence.

Wether you are a OMAC or SORT supporter. OMAC is trying to rally the troops to support them and as even they can attest to it, it is like pulling teeth to get these "Concerned Racers" to volunteer to help their or any cause that will in the end help out all racers.

Get in the fight wether you support either side but do something to help. UNreal ! ! I am trying to light a fire under everyone and all I hear is whining.



no you're not. re-read your initial posts to Da Surfa in this thread. and then don't make all innocent and try and turn this into "I'm doing this, what are YOU doing" thread. my only issue was your high and mighty action towards him without even giving us n00bs a chance.

you're obviously NOT getting the point about chasing potential support away. you want help don't act like a fucking dick.

and if you want to continue this e-thugging, you're still wasting your time acting all Mr. Tough Guy behind your screen. why don't you get some balls and act like this to my face?

nevermind, i know you're just going to try and turn this around and blame your initial asshole actions on us n00bs who merely came for info.

Admin, is this how you want SORT to be portrayed? perhaps i should just write email against SORT just to spite this asshole whether i support you guys or not. :D

[lois]

hey at least get more guys reading...because Tracy wants to act all beeg to the lil girl!:D

[lois]

The way I understand the history of the place is that it was originally built on AG land which was not a problem in 1964. The LUO "Land Use Ordinance" was subsequently changed to require motorsports facilities on Oahu to have industrial zoning. (This is not a problem for HRP given the geographic location.) Rather than having the property rezoned, the leaseholders opted to obtain a "variance" which allowed them to operate the track on AG land without a zoning change - saving a considerable amount of money on property tax. It is interesting that the track operated without the variance for over a year without being fined for it. The leaseholders could have also applied for another variance. So the expired variance was yet another bullshit reason to close the track IMO.

The EPA mandate concerning cesspools is something many individual homeowners have had to deal with and it doesn't cost $2 million dollars to connect to the sewer line which is what the leaseholders were telling everyone. Another bullshit reason to close the track. At any rate, Pardise Lua offered and provided free portable toilets so the racers could continue racing, until the track was finally closed last April.

With regards to animosity...The buy option at 13 million for a 67 acre park with a racetrack on it was not a bad deal. I personally know some racers that could have joined a hui and purchased the track to keep it running. We were never given that opportunity. We were all being told that the "lease had expired and could not be renewed". And then that Campbell had sold the property to the developer without MO's involvement. We know now that those statements were not true.

As Mud and the others continually point out - we were screwed out of a track. Now the OMAC members think we are going to support the "developers" that screwed us. So they can acquire 139 acres of DHHL property for 10 cents on the dollar. Then resell it for their own personal profit? No thanks. :mad:


ah ok. this makes it a little clearer.

i'm reading the links to the newspaper articles AND also reading stuff from the "other side". i just want info.

Dirt, i apologize for MY part in the off-topic posts but you have to get your asshole friend under control before he drives potential support away.

[DaSurfa]

I knew it,,, Dirt,,, This forum is gonna be Status Quo as in a bash center,,, There is nothing that will be positive in this forum when the bashing,cursing and ladi di and ladi da are done on other forums that are getting pretty old and unamusing,,, Its the same ole stuff here,,,,

I guess I'll less frequent it and stop in every now and then just to see if there is anything informative,,,, That thread on that F100 is a good one,,,,, I am just looking for a good thread on the track sitcho that will read

Track is under construction or The land has been obtained,,,,

I dont care about a winning side,,, I dont see it that way..


I have stated this before and I firmly believe that the Winners Are

The Racers,,,,,,, Thats who wins,,,, Oooooops the race fans also,,, :D


& the ones that did the hard work are the ones who succeeded at providing that track,, and ,Yes they should be praised for it and congradulated,,,,no doubt,,,, I am looking forward to that time , and I am gonna be positive and say WHEN :cool: it happens,,, & not the IF ;)


Surfa is out,,,

[Admin]

Admin, is this how you want SORT to be portrayed? perhaps i should just write email against SORT just to spite this asshole whether i support you guys or not. :D

Again, this Admin believes in the concept of free speech. You may not agree with a certain poster's delivery, but they may have unique information about the racetrack situation. All I ask is that the posters stay on topic with their news, opinions, and information. This way, even though we don't have a racetrack open on Oahu, at least the racers can find out what is going on without one group trying to control information for their benefit. Which is what has been happening, IMO.

In regards to SORT, it is not fair to judge them based on statements from their supporters, or supporters of HRP, or racing in Hawaii in general. I suggest you contact SORT leaders directly: Evelyn @ 255-8297 and Jeanette (AKA Paradise Racer) @ 478-8520. I can assure you will find them polite, intelligent, and knowledgeable about the racetrack situation (past and present). Anyone wanting to help with lobbying or constructing SORT's new track will be welcomed. :)

[lois]

Again, this Admin believes in the concept of free speech. You may not agree with a certain poster's delivery, but they may have unique information about the racetrack situation. All I ask is that the posters stay on topic with their news, opinions, and information. This way, even though we don't have a racetrack open on Oahu, at least the racers can find out what is going on without one group trying to control information for their benefit. Which is what has been happening, IMO.

In regards to SORT, it is not fair to judge them based on statements from their supporters, or supporters of HRP, or racing in Hawaii in general. I suggest you contact SORT leaders directly: Evelyn @ 255-8297 and Jeanette (AKA Paradise Racer) @ 478-8520. I can assure you will find them polite, intelligent, and knowledgeable about the racetrack situation (past and present). Anyone wanting to help with lobbying or constructing SORT's new track will be welcomed. :)


i'm certainly NOT saying to ban him or anything...i believe in free speech as well but if you want more support you guys better not chase away potential support by acting all Mr. Tough Guy over the Net. the more info i read from all over...googling, etc., the more i'm betting Mr Tough Guy was the obnoxious one yelling in the back at all the meetings, giving the general public and politician a bad image of ALL racers. who the hell wants to listen to a loudmouth moke yelling and shoving his opinion down your throat? no one wants to listen to that. surely YOU don't?

and you think we want to come here for "balanced" info when all Mr Tough Guy can do is attack n00bs? screw that. at the very least you should kick him off of your "Welcoming Committee" cause to be honest he really SUCKS at that job.

now if i can get back to Mr. Dirt Racer giving me his straight info withOUT Mr. Tough Guy E-Thug acting all big and running his mouth, i'd appreciate it.

because in the end, while you would HOPE this would be:



In regards to SORT, it is not fair to judge them based on statements from their supporters,


that's what's gonna happen. and dealing with that asshole has already begun to leave a very bad taste in my mouth.

*spits*

[lois]

I knew it,,, Dirt,,, This forum is gonna be Status Quo as in a bash center,,
I guess I'll less frequent it and stop in every now and then


see? you can thank your loudmouth friend for that

[straightliner]

Oh, a feisty one :D

Where have you been for the last year plus?

[lois]

Oh, a feisty one :D

Where have you been for the last year plus?



i been on FH since 2003, been feisty all my life though. i ain't gonna take shit from no one. and certainly not from someone who won't say it to my face. i never post anything i wouldn't say to your face. that's my rule. :D

FH sucks now cause there's only stupid kids posting left. i posted mainly in Auto Chat helping kids diagnose stuff and in the Recon forum (i used to work at recon).

forgive me if i didn't venture to the other parts of the board (the Racetrack forums)...it simply did not interest me much anymore. like i said my pitting days were back in the day (early to mid 90s) for an ex who raced in Pro Gas. after he lost interest and we broke up i never went. sad that that place is gone, had many wild nights there.

so here i am TRYING to do something constructive since all i am doing at work is wasting time posting on message boards. :D

[straightliner]

Lois,

You should have seen it (all 19-20 pages) before the big FH dump. :mad:

I too kept hearing all the different rumors about the track and or tracks. Dirt Racer would post up documents and the OMAC clowns would attack. These folks from SORT would post and more attacks would come. I've talked with them (SORT) over the last year and can see that what these guys and gals are our only help on the horizon at getting something going again.

I can see punishum point of view too. It's really fucked up when you work to get something going and the guys who are beneifiting from your hard work give you shit.

Over the last year I can tell who's full of shit and who's not. :mad:

[DaSurfa]

To be honest and truthful... Straightliner,,,, I see attacks from both sides,,, Its like world war 3 on a smaller scale.... :(

As a fellow racer and enthusiast I feel your pain,,,,& No pill can kill it Too :( I just hope that either side can get something.. The Temporary venue is with the SORT Side and thats exciting in the fact that they have something possible.... I am not saying parcel 9 is not possible But i can say It hasnt happened yet and its been awhile since we have heard anything from them on that sitcho if you think about it,, I am starting to wonder if thee old saying

" The calm before the Storm" may be in the makings ?????


Its frustrating and interesting and A Pain in thee ARSE to not know....

But what can we do besides supporting and participating ???


Surfa

[dirt racer]

"i ain't gonna take shit from no one"


Welcome aboard lois! :D

I think we found an avatar for ya...

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g14/dirt_racer/Oren.jpg

[punishum]

Talk to the hand, who is talking shit now? I am out in the public all the time.

You can say what you like and I gotta bite my tongue?

If you know me then you know my history too. Good Luck if you chose to accept this mission and continue on this path.

[lois]

Talk to the hand, who is talking shit now? I am out in the public all the time.

You can say what you like and I gotta bite my tongue?

If you know me then you know my history too. Good Luck if you chose to accept this mission and continue on this path.



brah...you were the one talking shit to Da Surfa first. that's why i posted. i was just going to lurk. for real. however i don't think he deserved your condescension when he clearly asked you not to. and you continued.

you see me attacking your other bullshit-free posts? NO? well there's your clue since you haven't had one since i started reading.

[lois]

Welcome aboard lois! :D

I think we found an avatar for ya...

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g14/dirt_racer/Oren.jpg


heh, thanks for the belated welcome. and thanks for all the info. i read a lot of different articles and posts and threads from all over.

[lois]

Lois,

You should have seen it (all 19-20 pages) before the big FH dump. :mad:

I too kept hearing all the different rumors about the track and or tracks. Dirt Racer would post up documents and the OMAC clowns would attack. These folks from SORT would post and more attacks would come. I've talked with them (SORT) over the last year and can see that what these guys and gals are our only help on the horizon at getting something going again.

I can see punishum point of view too. It's really fucked up when you work to get something going and the guys who are beneifiting from your hard work give you shit.

Over the last year I can tell who's full of shit and who's not. :mad:

straightliner and dirt racer--

as i've said i'm just reading a lot of info from "both" sides...and...this is MERELY an initial assessment from a (for now) neutral observer...

the way i see it, is that there are guys who are idealists and realists and fundamentally, these two parties have always been at odds. UNFORTUNATELY both of these parties (you guys) have a common wish: to get a race track back. right? energy is wasted at labeling people as "traitors" or "stupid" or what have you. there's probably only truly "uninterested" or "uninformed" at the mo.

it really shouldn't be a debate about who's right vs. wrong, who's left and who's right, who's black and who's white. it should transcend partisanship because there IS A COMMON GOAL. no matter where it is.

i can understand disagreements about the tactics and what went down previously but the head butting really needs to stop as it is truly not constructive at all, as evidenced right here...y'all need to find some consensus in your BASIC common goal and interests.

mend bridges if you can...otherwise you'll confound the people who you need the most...supporters of A racetrack.

yeah this is Pollyanna signing out. i'll read up more tonight. :D

[Need4Speed]

They don't need support. This is a personal conflict that goes way back, probably before you were born. That's how things are unfortunately, it appears to be at the expense of the racers.

[lois]

They don't need support. This is a personal conflict that goes way back, probably before you were born. That's how things are unfortunately, it appears to be at the expense of the racers.


hahaha! i'm not that young, you know. but thanks :D

[dirt racer]

They don't need support. This is a personal conflict that goes way back, probably before you were born. That's how things are unfortunately, it appears to be at the expense of the racers.

This may be a personal conflict for some of the people involved, but to a lot of us it's about having a racetrack or not having a racetrack.

And with regards to common goals, lois, I'm not so sure there is one. The way I see it - one side is trying to get racing going again, and the other side is only interested in making money (whether racing is involved or not).

This is not about hating one person, it's about the reality of what transpired. Right or wrong? Tactics? I'd say it's about who's lying and who's telling the truth.

I got involved in this by reading about what was being proposed - a World Class Racing Facility on Parcel 9. The story being told at the time by the "developer" was that there was going to be a new track on Parcel 9 within a year. I found that extremely odd being that there was a tenant (The Pasha Group) currently occupying that property that had invested 7 million dollars in setting it up. So I called Pasha Group to find out from them what the story was. They were completely shocked to hear that anyone was claiming that there was going to be a racetrack constructed on that property. Their landlord then CALLED ME (upset) and assured me, in no uncertain terms, that anyone who was saying there was going to be a racetrack built there was full of shit.

Now we have these same "developers" which also happened to have the lease/buy option for HRP claiming that the lease for HRP was expiring and could not be renewed. And that the landowner (Campbell Estate) was selling the property to a commercial developer out from under them.

Then we find out what the truth was - that the landowner did not ask the tenant (HMC) to move out. And that the deal to sell the property WAS PUT TOGETHER by the lease/buy option holder, who profited from the sale. And it was the lease/buy option holder that had asked for the "confidentiality agreement".

[mike_w]

Sorry I'm in little late to the party here. I been busy with getting ready to move my office.

Seen all the post lately and looks like there are still a lot of issues out there.

Mr. Liner,

You shouldn't post things like "toss them in the harbor". It's kind of like how some people posted on another forum site about burning down the tower at the drag strip a week before it happened. Though the idea of a dunking tank was good. If anything happens at OMAC's car show, it's going to be looked at as SORT's fault. An example would be it was an agent of SORT who tossed them in, or it could be SORT's evil jedi mind control that made someone fall in. The simple thing to do is nothing. Don't write about them, don't talk about them, don't even get close to them. Stay far far away.

Just a comment.

Mike W

[dirt racer]

Sorry I'm in little late to the party here. I been busy with getting ready to move my office.

Seen all the post lately and looks like there are still a lot of issues out there.

Mr. Liner,

You shouldn't post things like "toss them in the harbor". It's kind of like how some people posted on another forum site about burning down the tower at the drag strip a week before it happened. Though the idea of a dunking tank was good. If anything happens at OMAC's car show, it's going to be looked at as SORT's fault. An example would be it was an agent of SORT who tossed them in, or it could be SORT's evil jedi mind control that made someone fall in. The simple thing to do is nothing. Don't write about them, don't talk about them, don't even get close to them. Stay far far away.

Just a comment.

Mike W

Welcome aboard Mike W!

There's no reasoning with that group, that's for sure. I like how it's SORT's fault that HB567 failed even though THERE WERE ONLY SORT MEMBERS DOWN THERE IN SUPPORT OF IT! :rolleyes:

OMAC's house of cards was bound to fall down sometime. I guess we should have figured they'de blame that on SORT too.

[straightliner]

Arch-Idiot must have got his little boto stuck in his zippa on FH.:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: 3.30 something for gas :mad: I wouldn't waste my time going to town for that faka's car show. :mad: :mad: :D :D

[dirt racer]

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g14/dirt_racer/kitchenspressrelease1.jpg
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g14/dirt_racer/kitchenspressrelease2.jpg
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g14/dirt_racer/kitchenspressrelease3.jpg

A perfect example of "OMAC Propaganda" from this email sent to news organizations by OMAC's chairman.

"SORT belives just because it doesn't say DIRT, that it's not going to be dirt..."

Not exactly what the racetrack "developer" says:

"Oakland said he would consider a dirt track as an option at Kalaeloa but will not make any guarantees."
http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/2006/Apr/03/ln/FP604030349.html

Lo and behold - the actual blueprints say it's ASPHALT. And that funny shaped "motocross track" is in reality a "go-kart track". I really don't see why anyone would think it's going to be DIRT if it says ASPHALT. I guess the truth was never his strong point.

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g14/dirt_racer/P9BSPlan1-1.jpg

[Mud Packer]

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g14/dirt_racer/kitchenspressrelease1.jpg
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g14/dirt_racer/kitchenspressrelease2.jpg
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g14/dirt_racer/kitchenspressrelease3.jpg

A perfect example of "OMAC Propaganda" from this email sent to news organizations by OMAC's chairman.


Not exactly what the racetrack "developer" says:

http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/2006/Apr/03/ln/FP604030349.html

Lo and behold - the actual blueprints say it's ASPHALT. And that funny shaped "motocross track" is in reality a "go-kart track". I really don't see why anyone would think it's going to be DIRT if it says ASPHALT. I guess the truth was never his strong point.

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g14/dirt_racer/P9BSPlan1-1.jpg

He's just mad because they made the fences higher.